Trust买投资房

mel666

建了个trust，trustee是一个公司。是用这个公司买呢还用trust的名字买呢？如果用这个公司买了，报税是不是报在trust税表下？如果想把房子的名字换成trust的名字，要付印花税吗？多谢

yw0830

You can not live in the house which is owned under your trust. You can only buy investment property and rent to third party under trust. Otherwise, you would be better to buy a house under individual name.

yw0830

如果想把房子的名字换成trust的名字，要付印花税吗？

May be not if same beneficiary. However, there will have CGT event when you transfer your house to trust.

LENNY_DONG

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-27 22:24
You can not live in the house which is owned under your trust. You can only buy investment property  ...

你在说养老金吧。。

TRUST为撒不可以

LENNY_DONG

报在TRUST名下，公司是虚有存在TRUSTEE而已

你这样结构购买优势

资产保护

分散收入，因为正现金流

以上讨论是你新买投资物业

已在个人名下或公司名下不推荐。要交印花税和CGT等等可能产生附加费用

simonlee

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 16:09
报在TRUST名下，公司是虚有存在TRUSTEE而已

你这样结构购买优势

这位似乎对trust很懂，是会计吗。

yw0830

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 16:07
你在说养老金吧。。

TRUST为撒不可以

Because there's Fringe Benefits Tax will capture you if you lived in the house owned by your trust. The tax rate is 46.5% on the gross up value.

http://www.ato.gov.au/businesses ... =/content/76140.htm

Trust let its beneficiaries, trustee company's deirectors, and associated people living in the house that will be deemed to give fringe benefits. The Fringe Benefit Tax will be calculated based on the market value of the rental income.

How to determine market value of the rental income. Easy, get a valuation report from estate agent every three years.

However, property was rented to third party, then bascially no one has prepared the valuation report in the past unless ATO asked to.

LENNY_DONG

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-28 18:30
Because there's Fringe Benefits Tax will capture you if you lived in the house owned by your trust ...

FBT产生没问题

但是没有说不能住啊。

我晕了

LENNY_DONG

question: I plan to buy my first property in Melbourne soon. I will live in this property for a minimum of six months, renovate it, and rent it out as an investment property. I’ve heard that borrowing via trust structures can be useful: What are the main pros and cons to using a discretionary family trust structure?

LENNY_DONG

Answer: You have started on the right foot by putting thought into the legal structure.  A trust is a relationship between a trustee and beneficiaries, where the trustee controls and deals with certain property for the benefit of the beneficiaries.  Under a family trust, the beneficiaries are typically members of the same family and the trustee (which would be you or a company you control) has a broad power or discretion to decide which beneficiaries will benefit from the trust.

One advantage is that the trustee can to select the persons who receive the net rental income, which may allow you to reduce the total income tax payable.  For example, if you have a spouse that is not earning taxable income, the trust could distribute the rental income to your spouse who may pay less tax than you if you received the income.  Unless or until you are able and willing to distribute income to a spouse or another family member on a lower marginal tax rate, you will not get any tax benefits from a trust.

A family trust may also assist in protecting the equity in the property from potential creditors.  If you have an exposure to personal liability, then you are better placed to protect the property if a claim is made against you personally.

During the time that you live in the property, the trust will be able to rent the property to you and offset the expenses (including interest) against the rental income.  If you purchase the property in your own name, you will not be able to claim any expenses as a tax deduction until such time that the property is leased to a tenant.
You will also generally be able to take advantage of the small business concessions for capital gains tax in the same way as if you purchased the property in your own name.  The trust can also take advantage of the 50% discount where the trust holds the property for more than 12 months.  This means the net capital gain on which tax is paid is halved.

There are disadvantages, too. You will not be eligible to claim the first home owners grant, nor will you be able to claim the "principal place of residence" exemption from capital gains tax if you decide to live in the property and then sell it.  If you intend to negatively gear the property to offset the interest against your other personal income, the trust will not enable you to do this.

A discretionary family trust is not suitable where you wish to invest with other people outside your immediate family group or introduce other investors down the track. Another form of trust, such as a unit trust, may be more suitable in this situation.  

Finally, a trust will add some complexity and cost to your financial, tax and accounting affairs.  You will need to engage an accountant experienced in trusts to advise you along the way.

LENNY_DONG

simonlee 发表于 2013-4-28 18:29
这位似乎对trust很懂，是会计吗。

小会计一个。。。

yw0830

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 19:01
FBT产生没问题

但是没有说不能住啊。

Would you live in the house which you would have to pay additional 46.5% tax?

vking

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 16:09
报在TRUST名下，公司是虚有存在TRUSTEE而已

你这样结构购买优势

问个问题，一个trust下有trustee A P/L 和B P/L 一个房子从A卖给B，要交印花税吗？

vking

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-28 19:04
Would you live in the house which you would have to pay additional 46.5% tax?

问个问题，一个trust下有trustee A P/L 和B P/L 一个房子从A卖给B，要交印花税吗？

LENNY_DONG

vking 发表于 2013-4-28 19:47
问个问题，一个trust下有trustee A P/L 和B P/L 一个房子从A卖给B，要交印花税吗？ ...

那你这个房子是不是TRUST名下的？

如果是

你只是换了TRUSTEE，拥有产权的人还是没有变化

所以不存在印花税

LENNY_DONG

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-28 19:04
Would you live in the house which you would have to pay additional 46.5% tax?

我如果买个房子，TRUSTEE是我个人。

我付什么FBT了？

我不出租也不报费用，我就住在里面，不可以了？FBT从何谈起？


麻烦你看看我贴的回帖

9楼和10楼。

vking

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 20:27
那你这个房子是不是TRUST名下的？

如果是

明白了，不是我自己，我踫到的一个问题。我是Sam了，king seller

yw0830

vking 发表于 2013-4-28 19:49
问个问题，一个trust下有trustee A P/L 和B P/L 一个房子从A卖给B，要交印花税吗？ ...

我分裂了，一個trust有兩個trustee companies。從事稅務多年，沒見過。

LENNY_DONG

vking 发表于 2013-4-28 22:17
明白了，不是我自己，我踫到的一个问题。我是Sam了，king seller

我知道你是谁。。。哈哈哈

yw0830

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 20:35
我如果买个房子，TRUSTEE是我个人。

我付什么FBT了？

If you lived in the house owned by trust:

Example 1:

Market Rental Value:                 $18,000

Rental Expenses:                       $21,000 (all paid by you, did not make any tax deduction claims under trust account, no
                                                   problem, no FBT)


Example 2:

Market Rental Value                  $18,000

Rental Expenses:                      $12,000 (claimed tax deduction under trust account)
                                              ---------------
                                                      6,000 (Either take up FBT reimbursements to the trust account, or calculate FBT)

Example 3:

Market Rental Value                  $18,000

Rental Expenses:                      $12,000 (did not want to claim any tax deduction under trust account)
                                              ---------------
                                                      6,000 (Either take up FBT reimbursements to the trust account, or calculate FBT)

Trust account entries would still be:

Owners Contribuion:                 $12,000
Rental Expenses                      -$12,000
                                               -------------
Net effect                                   $         0

However, there are still fringe benefits provided to you for $6,000. You would still either take up another $6,000 as FBT reimbursements or work out FB tax). Same result as Example 2.

yw0830

Another thing:

- If you lived in the house you personally owned and then sold it out, no CGT.

- If you lived in the house owned by the trust, then sold it out. CGT

LENNY_DONG

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-28 22:44
Another thing:

- If you lived in the house you personally owned and then sold it out, no CGT.

你说了那么多

最后还是没有回答我的问题

我能自已住吗？


我说可以

我可以自已租给自已吗？

我说可以

你的例子行业内都明白。但是你却绕来饶去

yw0830

LENNY_DONG 发表于 2013-4-28 22:49
你说了那么多

最后还是没有回答我的问题

你可以住在trust owned的房子里，但你可能要付FBT，賣時要付CGT。

你也可以住在你個人名下的房子里，沒有FBT的煩惱，賣時也沒有CGT的煩惱。

選擇權在你手中，由你把握。

vking

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-28 22:25
我分裂了，一個trust有兩個trustee companies。從事稅務多年，沒見過。

这个trust下有5个trustee PL

yw0830

vking 发表于 2013-4-28 23:01
这个trust下有5个trustee PL

You would have to read the orginal trust deed. It generally came with a schedule saying who were the trustee company for the trust.

The trust can own other companies' shares. It didn't mean these companies are the trustees of the trust.

changcheng

Mark

mel666

投资房买在了trustee名下，trustee是个公司，这样的话，如果想再改到trust名下，需要交印花税吗？

LENNY_DONG

yw0830 发表于 2013-4-27 22:24
You can not live in the house which is owned under your trust. You can only buy investment property  ...

That is your inital post.which different what u said

JohnnySu

mel666 发表于 2013-4-29 07:43
投资房买在了trustee名下，trustee是个公司，这样的话，如果想再改到trust名下，需要交印花税吗？ ...

Trust is not a separate legal entity, It is established by the agreement amongst the Appointor, the settler, and the trustee.

A trust can NOT be on the title of any property. If you intend to acquire a property under a trust. The TRUSTEE has to be the owner on the title. Although in the contract you can specify the trustee is acting on behalf of the trust.

JohnnySu

Beneficiaries can live in a property owned by a trust however properties held in trust are only eligible for the Main Residence CGT Exemption in very limited circumstances.