炒股票用的上网费能抵税吗?

qichxi

打算买个telstra的无线上网,一个月90澳元,用来做澳大利亚期货.晚上自己看看网页.

一年下来1000多澳元,能不能抵税?哪里有这方面的出处?

Nocturnal

Firstly, you need to regularly trade derivatives or shares so that your activity can be classified as operating a business. Then you can proportion the your internet usage for business and claim that portion of usage for business expenses.

For example: You trade 4 times a week, with turnover value greater than $20,000. Then you can classify your activity as running a trading business. Your internet usage for business is 30%, then you can claim 30% of $1000 internet cost, which comes to $300.

qichxi

谢谢,有这方面的税务资料吗?

关于证券的投资成本抵扣税的事.

qichxi

买笔记本呢?

Nocturnal

Yes. But you dont claim the laptop expense in one hit. Rather, you are claiming the depreciation on your laptop value across a number of years. I recall 3-5 years. Again you have to proportion your private use to business use.

Eg. Laptop cost $2000. depreciate over 5 years equals $400 each year. You only use the laptop 40% of time for business. So deductible depreciation expense is 40% of $400 = $160. over 5 year period, you would have claimed $800 in depreciation expense assuming you use straight line method in calculating depreciation.

Please note this is not tax advice, just giving you some answer to your questions. everyone's situation is different and ATO requires you to make your own assessment on whether you are engaging in business activity. You can go to ATO to find out more info on business activity and depreciation rules.

swatow

当然可以..还可以报home office 的花费...纸,笔,电之类的...
但是也报不了很多

Nocturnal

You can only claim home office expenses when there is actually a room dedicated for home office use. So if you are trading shares in your own bedroom, it should not be classified as home office and therefore you cant claim any expenses such as rent, electricity etc. but stationery expenses should be ok

qichxi

感觉Nocturnal兄好专业啊,但是我不明白classify your activity as running a trading business,是small business吗?

还有这个cost是offset吗?

休

The question of whether a person is a share trader or a share holder is determined in each individual case. This is done by considering the following factors that have been used in court cases:

   1. the nature of the activities, particularly whether they have the purpose of profit making
   2. the repetition, volume and regularity of the activities, and the similarity to other businesses in your industry
   3. the keeping of books of accounts and records of trading stock, business premises, licences or qualifications, a registered business name and an Australian business number
   4. the volume of the operations, and
   5. the amount of capital employed.

The difference between a share trader and a share holder

The way in which income and expenditure are dealt with in relation to shares varies depending on whether you are a share trader or a share holder.

While the Tax Office considers each case on its individual features, in summary a share trader is a person who carries out business activities for the purpose of earning income from buying and selling shares. This person's position may be briefly summarised as:

    * receipts from the sale of shares constitute income
    * purchased shares would be regarded as trading stock
    * the nature, regularity, volume and repetition of the share activity are consistent with those of a share trading business
    * costs incurred in buying or selling shares are an allowable deduction in the year in which they are incurred, and
    * dividends and other similar receipts are included in assessable income.

A share holder is a person who holds shares for the purpose of earning income from dividends and similar receipts. This person's position may be briefly summarised as:

    * the cost of purchase of shares is not an allowable deduction, but is a capital cost
    * receipts from the sale of shares are not assessable income – however, any net profit is subject to capital gains tax
    * a net loss from the sale of shares may not be offset against income from other sources, but may be carried forward to offset against future capital gains made from the sale of shares
    * costs incurred in buying or selling shares are not an allowable deduction in the year in which they are incurred, but are taken into account in determining the amount of any capital gain
    * dividends and other similar receipts are included in assessable income, and
    * costs (such as interest on borrowed money) incurred in earning dividend income are an allowable deduction at the time they are incurred.

qichxi

那么trader和holder有什么税务的区别?

Nocturnal

trader's gain from share trading is classified as business income and loss classified as business expenses, plus all other cost associated with trading such as laptop usage, internet, home office are all business expenses. If total expenses is more than total income, then the expenses remaining can be used to offset income from other sources eg rental income, interest income, work income.

Eg, your trading income is $40,000, but your expenses (include trading losses) is $50,000. Your net business loss is $10,000. If you have salary of $50,000, then your taxable income is now only $40,000.

share holder's gain from shares is consider capital gain and losses are consider capital loss. Capital loss can only be used to offset capital gain. so in the above mentioned example, your $10,000 capital loss cannot be used to offset your salary of $50,000. Also as you are not running an business, you cannot claim expenses such as home office.

so if you plan to trade shares or derivatives regularly which means you dont hold onto them for more than 1 year, then its more beneficial to be a trader rather than holder. Refer to the detailed info provided by web master to see if you fit into the trader category.

again, this is not tax advice. you need use the info provided and consider your own situation

qichxi

呵呵,照楼上的说,我就是业务trade了.谢谢啊

qichxi

turnover value greater than $20,000,是除了少于一年的规律交易以外的必备条件吗?

休

原帖由 qichxi 于 2009-1-22 10:50 发表
turnover value greater than $20,000,是除了少于一年的规律交易以外的必备条件吗?

你那里看到的? 起码每年50个trade,turnover 大于50万.

Nocturnal

Apologies, I may have used the wrong word. Not "turnover", should be "assessable income". But my understanding is that assessable income = revenue before expenses, and revenue =  turnover, so these words can be used interchangeably. Anyway, the details can be find by searching 5806 on ATO website. Summary shown below:

If you make a net loss from a business activity you may claim that loss provided you meet one of the following conditions:
1 Your business activity is a primary production or professional arts business activity,
and your assessable income (excluding any net capital gain from other sources) not related to this activity is less than $40 000.
2 You meet at least one of 4 tests outlined on page v.
3 The Commissioner of Taxation has exercised a discretion to allow your losses to be claimed in the current year because there are special circumstances or your business has a lead time.

on page v. the 4 tests are:
1 Assessable income test—where the business activity produces assessable income of at least $20 000. For the purposes of this test assessable income is the gross earnings and other income of the business activity before deducting any expenses. Do not include income not related to the business activity
2 Profits test—where the business activity results in a tax profi t in 3 out of the past 5 years, including the current year
3 Real property test—where you own or lease real property with a value of at least
$500 000 (excluding any dwelling and adjacent land used mainly for private purposes) that is used on a continuous basis in your business activity. Real property generally includes both land and fi xtures, such as sheds, fences, dams and trees planted in the ground, but does not include fi xtures owned by a tenant.
4 Other assets test—where other certain assets that you own or lease and use on a
continuing basis in your business activity have a value of at least $100 000 (excluding cars, motorcycles and similar vehicles). Any items included under the real property test cannot be included under the other assets test.

hope this clarifies the matter. if web master is convinced with my answer, let me have some points thanks.

qichxi

休兄:

起码每年50个trade,turnover 大于50万?...........这个是哪里来的?我查了一下ATO,是有trading as small business,

但是好象说没有资金规模的要求,周期是一年内的交易,当然还要提供各种证明,证明你象做生意一样做trade.

但没有看到turnover>50万之说...

休

实际经验得来的.
turnover 50万平均每单只得一万,你去看看炒股贴,每手几万刀大有人在.trader 不是这么容易当的,要不ATO亏大了.

Nocturnal

hey i got rewarded points. thanks to webmaster xiu and webmaster black mountoun old demon haha (paopaobing(12))

qichxi

我也想给奖励,怎么给你们两?

qichxi

assessable income of at least $20 000. For the purposes of this test assessable income is the gross earnings and other income of the business activity before deducting any expenses

这一条测试就很难通过啊,等于意思是不考虑手续费,粗利润就要有20000.

如果有人很背的话,一年的粗利润没有20000,那就不符合要求了.

qichxi

Profits test—where the business activity results in a tax profi t in 3 out of the past 5 years, including the current year

这意思是不是说,如果今年第4年,不满五年.然后不满足3 out of the past 5 years,也就不符合要求了.

那么前4年的亏损都不能claim?

Nocturnal

assessable income test is easy to meet. everytime you sell a lot of shares, that count towards the assessable income.

Example: you buy 1000 cba shares at $20 per share, which is $20,000. 2 weeks later you sell them all at $30 per share, you have earned assessable income of $30,000.

深蓝

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