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楼主:jeffxia

[外汇债券] 澳元本轮下跌是澳洲资产泡沫破裂的开始 [复制链接]

发表于 2014-1-25 13:33 |显示全部楼层
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先到五再说
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发表于 2014-1-25 13:50 |显示全部楼层
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clur 发表于 2014-1-25 11:59
需求供给是都需要考虑的。单独靠澳洲的生产肯定满足不了全世界的需要。只要到岸价格比南美低,澳币低自然 ...

说的好像南美那边不会降价似的。 需求就那么点, 低澳币起不了太大作用。

发表于 2014-1-25 14:43 |显示全部楼层
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目光降落 发表于 2014-1-25 13:43
我还是比较赞同之前另外一个朋友的观点, 短期内, 资产涨, 租金跌。

资产泡沫还会持续一段时间, 澳洲资 ...

看法基本相同。个人观点,华人热门区的房价和中国经济情况有关,今年国内不容乐观。

发表于 2014-1-25 14:44 |显示全部楼层
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rmb才是王道

发表于 2014-1-25 15:21 |显示全部楼层
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今天的中国人并没有富欲到需要投资外国,据国家统计局最近公布的数据,56389元人民币就属于高收入人群,这些钱在澳洲生存都不易,投什么资?另根据全球最低工资排行榜,澳大利亚以每小时16.88美元的高薪高居榜首。而排名位居前列的大多数为发达国家,其中法国以每小时12.09美元的薪酬位居第二,新西兰以11.18美元的薪酬列第三位,中国内地最低薪资水平仅为0.8美元每小时。穷人投资富国是何逻辑?

论坛里有高人指出来澳洲买高端房的主要是“出逃资金”,我手里没有证据,但对于动辄出手几百几千万澳元的大妈、土豪实在不敢恭维,搞不清他们手中的巨额财富究竟来自何处,澳洲政府应该比我们了解的更清楚(汉人做奸细之敬业海内外皆知),什么样的钱不抢白不抢早有计算。

发表于 2014-1-25 15:26 |显示全部楼层
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jeffxia 发表于 2014-1-25 16:21
今天的中国人并没有富欲到需要投资外国,据国家统计局最近公布的数据,56389元人民币就属于高收入人群,这 ...

你的逻辑有问题 你的逻辑是中国的穷人没钱投资澳洲  中国的富人=5万6RMB收入  你自己想想合理嘛   胡润的评估里到2011年就有2.8万亿资产投资海外了 这些钱当然不是拿5万6的人拿出来的。  千万几倍里 64%的以上已经移民或者正在移民 不能移民的孩子还能移民
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发表于 2014-1-25 15:48 |显示全部楼层
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发表于 2014-1-25 17:56 |显示全部楼层
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都是大师呀!受教呢

发表于 2014-1-25 18:17 |显示全部楼层
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aud啥时候到过1.15,只是1.11吧
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发表于 2014-1-25 18:54 |显示全部楼层
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jeffxia 发表于 2014-1-25 16:21
今天的中国人并没有富欲到需要投资外国,据国家统计局最近公布的数据,56389元人民币就属于高收入人群,这 ...

你赚56389,不代表别人不赚563890

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参与人数 1积分 +3 收起 理由
West + 3 我很赞同

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发表于 2014-1-25 19:01 |显示全部楼层
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用56389说事,真的是无知了。13亿人,难道大家都56389这个标准?那么大一个国家别忘记了。去马路上看看,20-30万的车铺天盖地,一个车牌8万,你以为他们都是6-8年不吃不喝买一个车?这种想法抽自己脸。

再看看我家生意请的工人,6年经验的,我们现在付基本4500一个月,年终奖是5000,剩下的你自己算。我说的是初中学历,做普工的工人,请注意了。

要别人看得起你,首先你说话要自己看得起自己。
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发表于 2014-1-25 21:18 |显示全部楼层
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澳洲四大估值超越欧洲,是因为欧洲银行的估值在走下坡路而澳洲一直稳步上升。
澳洲房市的跌是有相对健康的贷款和REIT等等投资机构做支撑的,至少票面价值不会跌,而汇率跌。
中国未来人口红利减少对应的就是资产外流,澳洲不缺投资客。
房产投资回报率下降将成为普遍现象,和市中心的物业特征一样。政府对地皮和移民的控制是容易做到的。
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发表于 2014-1-25 21:27 来自手机 |显示全部楼层
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5000一个月刚刚够生活,前提是住爹妈家里无房贷无房租。

发表于 2014-1-25 21:47 |显示全部楼层
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坐,等

发表于 2014-1-25 21:49 |显示全部楼层
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屁股决定脑袋,看跌的,唯恐世界不崩溃的,基本上是岁数大的,辛苦多年,握点现金存银行,生怕正常的通货膨胀让自己的养老金缩水,让他们投资,也失去了胆量和能等待的时间,看到这些年投资赚钱的后生,就眼红的要死,心想老子当年的资产可是高你们数倍的,为什么就被拍在沙滩上了呢。这些年听谢国忠的年轻人不后悔的要死,任志强才是真正有良心的,所以论坛我看好悉尼好,你的言论基本无视
快快乐乐,
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发表于 2014-1-25 21:53 |显示全部楼层
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坐等房价上涨
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发表于 2014-1-25 21:54 |显示全部楼层
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等澳币到五。

发表于 2014-1-25 21:59 |显示全部楼层
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Tomm 发表于 2014-1-25 22:49
屁股决定脑袋,看跌的,唯恐世界不崩溃的,基本上是岁数大的,辛苦多年,握点现金存银行,生怕正常的通货膨 ...

任志强在日前参加新京报活动时表示,自己做了十几年房地产报告,今年首次用了“风险”两个字来警示同行。任志强表示,非常担心还有人认为今年的房地产市场会保持2013年那样的涨幅。

发表于 2014-1-25 22:03 |显示全部楼层
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悉尼好 发表于 2014-1-25 20:01
用56389说事,真的是无知了。13亿人,难道大家都56389这个标准?那么大一个国家别忘记了。去马路上看看,20 ...

你爹没教你悠着点儿,到处“我家工人”之类的胡说八道什么

发表于 2014-1-25 22:33 |显示全部楼层
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投资方。大妈其实没有本地人手上房子多。。。汇率也好股票也好。。。完全不是澳洲说的算。现在跟香港好像。完全看中国经济走向。地产。金融。旅游。跟香港太像了。。。

发表于 2014-1-25 22:34 |显示全部楼层
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正如香港人骂大陆人炒房什么的。最后还是香港人自己炒的房子 。
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发表于 2014-1-25 22:44 |显示全部楼层
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博闻 发表于 2014-1-25 14:11
澳洲绝大多数投资房,还是在本地人手里吧?

澳洲物业监察的数据,购买新楼花的人90%是本地买家,海外买家只占10%。
认真做事 潇洒做人

发表于 2014-1-25 22:52 |显示全部楼层
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vvuuww 发表于 2014-1-25 10:08
有人分析过, 人民币对美元是4:1的合理价, 所以对澳元大概是3:1合理 (近十年澳对美均价0.76). ...

有共鸣
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发表于 2014-1-25 22:57 |显示全部楼层
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本帖最后由 West 于 2014-1-25 23:59 编辑
条纹布 发表于 2014-1-25 23:52
有共鸣


我明天给你350万人民币,你给我100万澳元,让你赚50万,你干不干???

2傻子说1澳元换3块人民币,你共鸣个毛

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发表于 2014-1-25 23:04 |显示全部楼层
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West 发表于 2014-1-25 23:57
我明天给你350万人民币,你给我100万澳元,让你赚50万,你干不干???

2傻子说1澳元换3块人民币,你共 ...

别发飙,等到了那个价格再大方。人民币本身就是政策在控制。

发表于 2014-1-25 23:07 |显示全部楼层
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CITYLOOK 发表于 2014-1-25 14:30
矿产都是根据合同来的,
即便现在澳矿到岸价格便宜了
合同还在那里,撕不了 ...

除了长协矿,通常合同是一年的,所以现在贸易商都是在死撑,跌价不可怕,可怕的是跌价又跌量,把现金流搞到堆场上去。
不过和房价的直接关系貌似不大
用积分砸我
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退役斑竹 2007 年度奖章获得者 2008年度奖章获得者 特殊贡献奖章 参与宝库编辑功臣

发表于 2014-1-26 00:22 |显示全部楼层
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本帖最后由 黑山老妖 于 2014-1-26 01:26 编辑

澳洲的经济增长来源是人口增长。泡沫的问题是全世界的问题。


Dow Jones, down ~1.67%

S&P 500, down ~1.83%

Nasdaq, down ~1.99%

Aust Dollar, ~US87.09c

Flight to safety

Wall Street stocks fell heavily last night and the Aussie dollar got as low as 86.6. It’s currently at 87.1. Volatility indices have also jumped sharply. The S&P 500 is below 1800 for the first time this year and the Dow Jones has lost 1.5 per cent last night and 3.2 per cent for the week.

We’re seeing a flight to safety that could intensify next week. There’s a slight whiff of 1994 and 1997 about what’s happening. In 1994 the Federal Reserve raised interest rates and money flowed back into the US, precipitating what became known as Mexico’s Tequila Crisis. In 1997 there was only a small increase in US rates but there was a run on the Thai baht that precipitated the Asian financial crisis.

Once again emerging countries are under pressure because of tightening US monetary policy. This time the focus is on Argentina, a serial victim of capital outflows. Last week the peso fell 18 per cent and the country’s foreign reserves are falling rapidly. As usual a lot of the problems are its own, including 25 per cent inflation and a whole lot of currency restrictions imposed in 2011, but Argentina is at the front line of a new flood of capital back into the US for safety. And sentiment wasn’t helped by a couple of disappointments this week about the Chinese economy (see below).

Gold is returning to favour, the yen is seeing a lot of buying and money is also flowing into 10-year US and German bonds, despite the low interest rates available on them. It’s coming out of emerging markets – Argentina, Thailand, Turkey, Ukraine … as well as the Australian dollar, which has been especially affected by the weaker than expected Chinese data.

The problem for emerging markets, and the Australian dollar, is that they are at the mercy of foreign capital, and that means events far away that have nothing to do with the country concerned can have a huge impact. Those events often involve the Fed in some way because the money is usually American, although Chinese money is starting to become very important as well. And not only has the US Fed started tightening monetary policy with the $10 billion-a-month taper, but also interest rates in China are rising as authorities try to control the expansion in credit there.

And in these situations equities tend to get sold as well, especially if they’ve had a decent run – as Wall Street has had over the past 18 months.

So hold onto your hats folks – this could be a rocky few weeks. But it’s not a time to panic. The fundamentals haven’t changed.



The third boom – people

Since the start of 2008, Australia’s gross domestic product has grown by 14%. America’s GDP has increased by only 6%, Canada’s by 7% and in the UK and Europe, GDP has fallen by 2%. In fact these past six years have been the icing on a remarkable cake: Australia is now in its 23rd year of continuous economic expansion. That’s never happened before in Australian history and I doubt that it’s happened in any other country either.

By the way, in Davos this week Tony Abbott criticised the Labor government for spending so much during the GFC. Well, I think it’s fair to say the main reason Australia escaped that financial crisis without a recession is because of the massive stimulus in China, which produced another kick in commodity prices and kept the mining investment boom going for a few more years. Did we need the fiscal spending the Australian government executed as well? Apparently the Prime Minister thinks not, but I wonder what he’s basing that on.

Anyway, for whatever reason, Australia has had an incredible run – in aggregate. But here’s something nobody talks about: it’s mostly because of the Kiwi diaspora. Over the past six years, Australia’s population growth has fluctuated between 1.5 and 2%. Last year it was 1.8%, which is about triple the growth of most other large countries. US population growth is 0.7%, China’s about 0.5% and likewise Europe and the UK. Japan’s population is actually shrinking.

Most of the growth comes from immigration. Last year the difference between births and deaths was 163,000 while net migration was 244,000, close to an all-time high.

Where are most of them coming from? New Zealand. About 12% of all Kiwis on the planet are living and working in Australia. Last year about 25,000 arrived (net), on top of 20,000 Chinese and 20,000 Indians (the next two largest group of migrants).

Last year GDP grew by 2.3%; without the extra people it would have grown just 0.5% – one of the weakest economic growth rates in the world. Over the past six years economic growth would have been almost flat without the big population growth in the early years to support the mining investment boom. According to calculations by Kieran Davies of Barclays Bank, over the past 12 months consumer spending would have been zero: the entire increasing in consumption last year was due to the increase in numbers.

Does this matter? Maybe not. Companies aren't too worried why sales are increasing – whether it’s because each individual is spending more or because there are more individuals spending the same – as long as sales do increase. And the fact that so many people want to come here and that Australians are confident enough to have a lot of children is great. You certainly wouldn’t want a shrinking population like Japan’s!

But the strong population growth is papering over some fundamental issues. Consumer spending is much weaker than it seems and this comes at a time of two big challenges: the end of the mining boom and a period of fiscal austerity. The reason the two challenges are happening at once is that they are related.

In Davos this week, Tony Abbott wasn’t making some kind of technical economic assessment of the fiscal response to the GFC. He was softening us up for spending cuts and tax increases this year.

It wasn’t just the spending in 2008-09 that has caused the huge structural deficit that the Abbott government has inherited. Fact is that both the Howard government the Rudd government treated the mining boom like an ATM and happily handed out the cash to win votes. As the mining boom ends those chickens come home to roost.

Actually it was two booms that produced those 23 years of uninterrupted expansion: the housing and credit boom of the 1990s and early 2000s, followed by a smooth - luckily - transition to the China-fuelled resources boom, starting around 2004. That boom peaked last year and as an indication of that the exchange rate has been falling since April, since when it has depreciated 17%.

There’s now a lot of discussion about what’s going to take over from the resources boom, not that it’s falling off a cliff but it has clearly peaked, especially with China’s economy slowing as they try to deal with their own double challenge: credit bubble and market-based reform.

So what’s the third boom? Not consumption and definitely not manufacturing unless the dollars falls below 80. Maybe housing, given booming house prices, and the fact that building approvals have increased 22% over the past year. But the house price boom is really confined to Sydney only and approvals have not yet translated into construction, which is up only 1.7% year on year.

No, I reckon the third boom is people – population growth. It is the reason our economic growth was among the fastest in the world last year and is underpinning everything else – consumption and dwelling construction. If the exchange rate keeps falling because of the US QE taper, that’s even better because manufacturing and agricultural exports would join the party.

So immigration must be kept up. In that context, let’s talk about asylum seekers. I’ve always hated the carry-on about boat arrivals because there are hardly any of them and I feel desperately sorry for wretches who hand over their life savings to Indonesian smugglers who put them into leaky boats to Christmas Island.

But I think it’s also true that this carry-on is a smokescreen for the immigration boom that’s been going on for a decade. Successive governments make a big hoohah about Stopping The Boats, while quietly ushering in 250,000 people a year on planes. If the xenophobes among us weren’t distracted by Stopping The Boats, they might pay more attention to the tens of thousands of migrants coming from the same places – and we need them!!

Anyway, that’s just a theory: can’t prove it.

The likelihood that Australia’s third boom is population growth also makes me favour Tony Abbott’s paid parental leave idea – against my better judgement, given the general need to cut back welfare, especially the middle class variety. In addition to immigration, couples need to keep having children. Six months’ pay at the same salary, which has been quarantined from the welfare review, could end up being an important economic policy.     

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Happy Wife = Happy Life
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发表于 2014-1-26 01:30 |显示全部楼层
此文章由 悉尼好 原创或转贴,不代表本站立场和观点,版权归 oursteps.com.au 和作者 悉尼好 所有!转贴必须注明作者、出处和本声明,并保持内容完整
澳洲最核心的问题是不具备任何实业,整个国家在想怎么偷懒拿快钱。
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发表于 2014-1-26 05:29 |显示全部楼层
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悉尼好是不是老吃韭菜啊?口气大了点。

发表于 2014-1-26 05:54 |显示全部楼层
此文章由 liangpi1234 原创或转贴,不代表本站立场和观点,版权归 oursteps.com.au 和作者 liangpi1234 所有!转贴必须注明作者、出处和本声明,并保持内容完整
本帖最后由 liangpi1234 于 2014-1-26 06:56 编辑
黑山老妖 发表于 2014-1-26 01:22
澳洲的经济增长来源是人口增长。泡沫的问题是全世界的问题。


坐飞机来的,大多潜伏下来变黑民吧,不能变成难民吧。

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